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Handling spoilers?

Jun 13, 2013
62
0
So earlier today, I was performing distortion. Afterwards, this one guy apparently knew how the trick works. So he looks at the other chick and begins to explain how I did the trick. I interupt and say "Hey, this will just be our little secret." He then says "Ya, and hers." and begins to ruin the trick for her.

I just took the David Blaine approach and just rolled with it. I didn't argue, I just let him have his moment of "brilliance", and now I don't perform around him. How do ya'll handle these situations, and should I have handled it differently?
 
Jun 25, 2014
22
2
I generally just avoid performing for that kind of person, if the person can't respect you and the art enough to keep the secrets to themselves then they don't get the privilege to watch you perform. I see a lot of tricks that I can't perform but know the secret to but I refused to give out the secrets to how they are done( I was the only magician at my old school before I graduated). I guess it's just kind of a rule, some people find those impossible to follow. I can't perform for my little brother because he is so eager to learn how to do the trick that he will try and foil a trick being performed at someone else. And let's be honest, he was just trying to impress the girl. Since I also practice picking pockets( as a hobby, not for stealing) I may have some fun, plant something, take something, and interrupt him with the reveal of say his wallet or phone. Then just toss it to him before turning and walking away.
 
Jun 13, 2013
62
0
I'm usually good about telling who figures tricks out easily and then spoils them. This was just a fluke. His dad used to be a clown and showed him how stuff like this worked. I typically avoid performing for people like that though.
 
May 21, 2014
127
6
Staunton, VA
For me it depends on the person, the situation, and where the heckling falls in the trick. Usually I just brush it off with a line and keep going. Some examples I use include:

"Wow...your way actually sounds easier than mine. I'll probably just start doing that from now on."
"Yes, yes, you're very smart...now shut up." I don't always throw the shut up in there unless I'm sure the crowd will laugh it off.
"Yeah, that one's not that good, is it?"

Also, sometimes you can use the crowd if you can tell they're on your side. If everyone gangs up and tells the heckler to shut up and buzz off, a lot of times they'll just storm away. You can even sometimes put a plant in your crowd to heckle the hecklers and stir up the crowd against them without having to even involve yourself.

If you're in a show setting, you might be able to preempt it by encouraging people to just smugly smile and nod if they figure something out or see something they're not supposed to. If you're roaming, you always have the option of just stopping the trick cold and walking away, especially if it's a voluntary or street performance you're not being paid for. Usually I just say something like, "Ah, I can see you hate magic, and also fun. My mistake," and just walk. Sometimes I don't say anything and just bolt.

Honestly, though, this hasn't happened to me in a while. I had one kid try to spoil some stuff during my first show at the local farmer's market, but it really wasn't that bad. I think the difference is that I don't take myself that seriously any more, though.My magician character used to be kind of serious and intense. I find the ridiculous wizard character draws a lot less heat for some reason. Maybe it's because people are less inclined to make fun of me or spoil my show when I'm making fun of myself half the time. It could also be because the funny schtick gives the would-be hecklers something besides the magic to focus on and enjoy. I don't really know what the difference is, but I just don't get heckled as much as I used to, and I think the main difference is that I don't worry about it as much.
 
Apr 17, 2013
885
4
Honestly, most everything I do is from before the 1950's or they are my own creations. I try really really hard to stay away from new effects, but I am a sucker for a good packet trick. This cuts down on someone doing the Greg Solomon types out there. (if you do not know who he is look him up on youtube). As you start to move away from the latest and greatest and get into creating you own stuff this will happen less and less.
 
Jun 25, 2014
22
2
I completely agree with that. Because I'm relatively new to magic I only have one trick I can truly call my own and it involves forcing a card and the doing a whole bunch of patter about turning the card invisible and what not and then pulling the card off my person. It's not the greatest but it always gets good responses from the crowds.
 

WitchDocIsIn

Elite Member
Sep 13, 2008
5,892
2,948
I'm trying to come up with a nice way of putting this, but it's difficult.

The problem is presentation and performance. If the audience is calling out methods, or spoiling your tricks, or not paying attention - you are failing to give them something better to do. If the audience is engaged and entertained, they won't have time to think about how you're doing what you're doing and they won't want to talk to the people around them for fear of missing something.

Are you narrating your tricks? Are you just walking up to people and starting a performance? Have you actually talked to them like people instead of assuming you are granting them an amazing privilege by letting them see you perform?
 
Jun 25, 2014
22
2
That didn't come off as nice at all. Some people will try to spoil the trick just because they want to make themselves appear smart. Obviously by what he stated the trick was over when the guy started spoiling the trick. He also stated that the guys father had told him how a lot of tricks were done. So it's not like he wasn't performing well or being uninteresting. It's simply that the guy was being a know it all and trying to impress a girl after the performance. Did you even read anything he said? Because it sounds like you're looking at the from the wrong perspective.
 
Sep 2, 2007
1,186
16
43
London
That didn't come off as nice at all. Some people will try to spoil the trick just because they want to make themselves appear smart. Obviously by what he stated the trick was over when the guy started spoiling the trick. He also stated that the guys father had told him how a lot of tricks were done. So it's not like he wasn't performing well or being uninteresting. It's simply that the guy was being a know it all and trying to impress a girl after the performance. Did you even read anything he said? Because it sounds like you're looking at the from the wrong perspective.

I'm not sure if that's true. As performers, we get to decide what our audiences will be like. Working different audiences, different rooms and different demographics is a skill you can practice and learn. If you don't take the time to properly gauge who your audience are and mould them into what want them to be then they're just going to be whoever they were when they turned up. And one of them might have turned up as a showoff or a troublemaker. To put it simply, if someone's your friend then they won't try and ruin your show. So, make friends with your audience.
 
Apr 17, 2013
885
4
That didn't come off as nice at all. Some people will try to spoil the trick just because they want to make themselves appear smart. Obviously by what he stated the trick was over when the guy started spoiling the trick. He also stated that the guys father had told him how a lot of tricks were done. So it's not like he wasn't performing well or being uninteresting. It's simply that the guy was being a know it all and trying to impress a girl after the performance. Did you even read anything he said? Because it sounds like you're looking at the from the wrong perspective.

Some of us here have been doing this longer than many of the users here have been alive. 90% of the time we can nail down that happened by reading what went down. Many newer and/or younger performers tent to do play by play when they are doing effects. Many younger magicians haven't really taken the time to learn when not to perform magic. They think everyone loves it just as much as they do and can't understand when things like this happen.

99% of the time I can do a quick scan of a crowd as I'm chatting them up if will be "That Guy" in the group. If there is I will move on to another group until he moves on. If I miss read someone and I get a That Guy who thinks he knows, then I just stop and walk away. I leave it to the people enjoying my work to handle him.

The best thing newer magician can learn is how to create engaging patter. Have a reason for the effect. Remember that WHY the effects happens is more important then the effect itself. Why does the card keep jumping to the top of the deck. WHY do the coins jump from one hand to the next. WHY should anyone care. Have a story to go along with you magic. Take some time and join a local summer troupe to get some acting staging and scripting work in. Find your local IBM SAM group and talk to the workers. Understand that the older guys while old know more about this than you do and be smart enough to listen to them. We aren't telling you this stuff to hear themselves talk or to be mean. We are telling you this because we spent the last number of years learning this and are willing to share it for free. So no we aren't being mean, we just know how things play out.
 
Jun 25, 2014
22
2
I get that with wisdom comes age and experience and I am almost positive that the majority of people on here are better at this than I am. But to assume you know all the facts and blame it on the guy performing isn't using that wisdom. Yes, it's very possible that he could have gauged the audience better. Yes, it's possible his patter wasn't very interesting. But it's also extremely possible that a person put him on the spot asking him to do a trick. And it is also possible that the guy was just walking by and came to see what the commotion was about. I'm not trying to be disrespectful but Christopher is coming of in a very condescending way to a guy asking for help. And instead of offering some constructive criticism he starts treating the man like an idiot. That last paragraph in and of itself is disrespectful to him. I'm all for constructive criticism, that's not the way it should be done.
 

WitchDocIsIn

Elite Member
Sep 13, 2008
5,892
2,948
Everyone does everything for a reason. It's our job to anticipate those reasons and get around them before they happen. In this case, I'm pretty sure the guy in question was probably just trying to seem like the alpha male to the lady. The performer subconsciously came across as a threat. Usually this is because the performer is "showing off" and basically acting like they are better than their audience, and gracing them with the benevolence of their performance. Or, the performer is boring so the audience thinks the point of this is to figure out how he did what he did.

So no, I didn't come up with a nice way of saying it. I went for blunt. Here's some more:

If your audience is reacting in a way you don't want, it is your fault, not theirs in most cases. Look at how you're performing and fix it, stop looking for excuses or "clever" ways to shut them down.
 

WitchDocIsIn

Elite Member
Sep 13, 2008
5,892
2,948
And instead of offering some constructive criticism he starts treating the man like an idiot. That last paragraph in and of itself is disrespectful to him. I'm all for constructive criticism, that's not the way it should be done.

So, pointing out the problem and suggesting how to fix it isn't constructive?
 
Apr 17, 2013
885
4
. That last paragraph in and of itself is disrespectful to him. I'm all for constructive criticism, that's not the way it should be done.

Well lets look at the post and i'll bold the part that you said is disrespectful...

I'm trying to come up with a nice way of putting this, but it's difficult.

The problem is presentation and performance. If the audience is calling out methods, or spoiling your tricks, or not paying attention - you are failing to give them something better to do. If the audience is engaged and entertained, they won't have time to think about how you're doing what you're doing and they won't want to talk to the people around them for fear of missing something.

Are you narrating your tricks? Are you just walking up to people and starting a performance? Have you actually talked to them like people instead of assuming you are granting them an amazing privilege by letting them see you perform?

That is a set of questions. A very good set of questions all new magicians need to ask themselves at all times. Before the "street magic" thing started magicians didn;t walk up to random people and just start invading their space. Again new magicians think that everyone loves magic. That is not the case.

There could be any number of reasons why this went the way it did. All Christopher did was ask the list of thing that happen more often than not when someone talks about when they were performing. WAnt to really fix the issue? Be more selective of who you perform for. i'll leave this quote from the great Michael Weber...

"The better the magician, the less he performs outside formal shows.
(and when he does, he chooses moments and material so carefully)"
 
Jun 25, 2014
22
2
Yes, the questions are needed but the way it was said could have been done better. I get you are all older but looking down on everyone younger makes you look like idiots. Yes, we have less experience, but the world is ever changing, things are different. Very few teenagers are going to have actual shows and rely on street magic to build a reputation. I am very selective with my audience and generally they ask me to perform, not the other way around. I don't invade a person's space because of my ego. Also, where do you get the idea I had everything handed to me in life? "Everyone gets a ribbon", seriously? I never take credit where it isn't earned, I have failed classes because I refused to cheat like everyone else, heck, I nearly got suspended from school for refusing to cheat. Just because I believe that everyone deserves the same amount of respect when you snobs don't doesn't put me in the wrong. Obviously, Christopher, you haven't been around some teenage "alpha" males. He didn't have to come off as a show off, some people just want to be seen as know it all's. Like the kid in class who constantly corrects everyone for everything, he has a reason, it's to look the smartest, like what this guy was trying to do. There is no inclination that the performer was showing off. Some people just think they have to be the best at everything. Now, maybe you don't see that because you refuse to perform street magic because you'd have to get up close and personal and there's a bigger risk in getting caught. But those of use who do get what it's like. You can't avoid performing because someone's a spoil sport. You don't have to lock yourself in an environment where people have no choice but to sit in silence because you're afraid that someone is going to try and call you out on a trick. When you're on the street, you get called out, it happens. But this "hide on stage where people who interrupt will be asked to leave" attitude has spoiled you. I challenge both of you to walk around performing tricks for a month and see what happens. Most people will just think it's cool or entertaining but someone is going to try and ruin it for everyone because they want to impress people too. I don't want to argue but you guys are just being so short sighted about this. Try seeing things from someone else's perspective and remember that you weren't always a super great, experienced magician yourself. You messed up, you had someone call you on something, you got embarrassed. Stop criticizing everyone else for being skilled and brave enough to entertain people who can't afford to get all dressed up and go to a fancy show. I once performed for a poor family that lived next door to my brother, completely impromptu street magic, but the joy and wonder on their faces. The excitement and thrill. That's the reason I perform. Not for a paycheck, not to impress someone, and certainly not to impress people like you.
 
May 6, 2013
148
5
www.Ibimania.com
Guys, can we stop discussing weather a post here was mean or hurt someone's feelings and focus on the subject.

How would YOU deal with a spoiler.

One response has been - Spot such people, do not perform for them.

Another is - Be so good that the audience focuses on you and not the secret. Also doing a routine instead of a single trick always helps.


Being a comedian, I'll tell you its best to have some pre-written lines for hecklers. I'll give you a start here.

"Hey buddy, wait, let me show you something then you can carry on sharing the secret.
This is a mind reading routine, I want you to close your eyes and think of a sentence, just write it on a paper and keep it in your back pocket. I will try to read you mind here and make sure I do not peek."

*Write something on paper and let the spectator, in your case, the girl read it*

She reads what you wrote and it goes like

"Oh the magician (or use your name) has bought a trick and practiced it so well that he is getting so much attention. I am so damn jealous, I know the secret but I haven't practiced so I cannot perform. I think if I reveal the secret maybe she will pay attention to me. I mean I do not really know how to get people to pay attention to me. I guess I will spoil the trick, that will make me look important"

Then go like "So was that what you were thinking?".

I sometimes take it further, when they show the paper they have and it says something else, I go like "Woah dude how did you manage to keep me from reading your mind, guys pay attention to him, he kept me from reading his mind".

You can edit/rewrite and see whatever goes for you. Make sure it stays playful. Some people are good at insult jokes, others make them look like dry insults.
 
Apr 17, 2013
885
4
Yes, the questions are needed but the way it was said could have been done better. I get you are all older but looking down on everyone younger makes you look like idiots.
We do not. That is reading into things.

Yes, we have less experience, but the world is ever changing, things are different. Very few teenagers are going to have actual shows and rely on street magic to build a reputation.
It has been talked about many times on this forum. There are many places other than going up to randoms on the street. Libraries hospitals retirement homes. Magic clubs hold shows once or twice a year. Community groups are also a great place to learn. So yes teenagers can find regular shows.

Also, where do you get the idea I had everything handed to me in life? "Everyone gets a ribbon", seriously? I never take credit where it isn't earned, I have failed classes because I refused to cheat like everyone else, heck, I nearly got suspended from school for refusing to cheat. Just because I believe that everyone deserves the same amount of respect when you snobs don't doesn't put me in the wrong. Obviously, Christopher, you haven't been around some teenage "alpha" males.
The everyone gets a ribbon is just a fact of youth in america born after 1980. As for the teenage alpha males? I played football hockey and wrestled in highschool. I know all about alpha males. We are not being snobs again if you are getting that maybe you need to slowdown and look at why you feel two guys who are sharing with you years of hard earn knowledge for free are snobs.

Now, maybe you don't see that because you refuse to perform street magic because you'd have to get up close and personal and there's a bigger risk in getting caught. But those of use who do get what it's like. You can't avoid performing because someone's a spoil sport. You don't have to lock yourself in an environment where people have no choice but to sit in silence because you're afraid that someone is going to try and call you out on a trick. When you're on the street, you get called out, it happens. But this "hide on stage where people who interrupt will be asked to leave" attitude has spoiled you. I challenge both of you to walk around performing tricks for a month and see what happens

I make my living as a close up magician. I do not have to do street magic, I get paid to do magic in homes and private parties. SO I don't have to be challenge to do close up magic for a month, it is pretty much all I do. If I don't then I do not eat.

I challenge you to take some time to read my other post. You would see I was close up magician of the year twice of the Ring when I was 17 and 18. That when I was 16 I was elected VP of the ring and then was president twice. You would see I did walk around magic for a company for years for company events. You would see I do busking you know the original street magic. You would see I do not do stage, I haven't done a stage act since 1997 when I did a Christmas part for 1000 people. So yes, I see it. I am up close when I do magic. I am of the Eugene Burger school of close up where I work for two or three people at a time when doing walk around. I have a parlor show that I also use as my busking act. So before YOU turn into a street magic snob telling a working close up magician that he doesn't know what it is like for the street magician, know who you are talking to.
 
Jun 13, 2013
62
0
lol, ya. I make sure that I win them over and a have good presentation and what not. I've gotten better with connecting with spectators and what not. This was just one of those people that wants everyone to think he's an "all knowing genius". after I performed for them I realized that he could care less about magic and just wanted to use it as a tool to make him seem knowledgable.
 
Jun 13, 2013
62
0
I've gotten to a point where I care more about giving everyone a good time than just being the "alpha male". I usually never perform for people who I can't connect with and thanks to my experience in "speed reading" people, I can pick out the best spectators. I normally never have trouble with spectators doing this, and if I do i usually just walk away "on good terms". I was just wondering if I handled this situation right.
 
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