Cardistry and Magic Problem

[MagicLemonBird]

Hi I'm at the point where I really like cardistry but I believe that magic hits people harder than cardistry overall. What do you guys think? Also, I'm deciding on getting the encyclopedia of playing card flourishes or, another magic trick. Which one should I get? Thanks, I could use the help

 

[visualartist]

Normally id say 'Durr!' to your first question,but your new to magic so its cool.
Dont start with single dvd magic tricks.
If you absolutely MUST do card magic.Card college is what I hear is the best.
Also Art of Astonishment by paul harris.Start with #1 obviously.
Life Savers by Michael Weber.
Magic:the complete course by joshua jay.
Now You See It, Now You Don't by Bill Tarr.(love this book)
Any of these are great. But before actually performing for people I recommend
An Actor Prepares by Constantin Stanislavski

 

[Squ!rrel]

The magic and cardistry issue has been debated endlessly and I don't intend to start it again, do a search and you'll find a lot of discussion on it. The consensus seems to be that flourishes can be incorporated into magic too some extent e.g. a few flashy cuts, fans or springs between effects but doing Pandora to mix up the deck really isn't going to convince a spectator the decks shuffled and will almost certainly weaken your magic.

Obviously, magic hits harder as they get a moment of astonishment and when performed well with an engaging presentation can leave a lasting impression on them. Flourishes will be perceived as being skillful and can be entertaining but lack any emotinal impact.

I've noticed you have a habit of starting a thread without doing any backround reading on a subject and repeating frequently asked questions and topics that have been debated endlessly, it's not a good habit to get into and is very lazy, use the search feature.

As for the magic trick vs flourishes, in my opinion it's an absolutely absurd question to ask us, how can we possibly know what you want. Surely you must be able to see that? Do you want to make a serious attempt to learn cardistry? If you do go for the Encyclopedia, if not go for magic.

 

[MagicLemonBird]

Which one is better, the True Astonnishment DVD's or the Art of Astonishment books?

 

[Squ!rrel]

Which one is better, the True Astonnishment DVD's or the Art of Astonishment books?

What's the point of posting if you don't read the replies? I just suggested you do a bit more research on stuff. People give you in depth replies and you come out with asinine questions in response, it's kind of annoying. Why not search for reviews and form your own opinions then come to us with what you've learned and ask for a bit of guidance, maybe tell us what stage you're at, what effects you already do, what you're looking for from the set instead of asking to be spoonfed answers. There's no real incentive for me, and I suspect many others, to help if you won't do anything yourself.

There's loads of reviews on both AOA and TA, both have their pro's and cons, it's impossible to simply say one is better than the other, it's different for each individual.

 

[MagicLemonBird]

Thanks, I read the reviews but there are still some questions that come to mind.

 

[toyrobot]

Hi I'm at the point where I really like cardistry but I believe that magic hits people harder than cardistry overall. What do you guys think? Also, I'm deciding on getting the encyclopedia of playing card flourishes or, another magic trick. Which one should I get? Thanks, I could use the help

Cardistry and flourishing tends to be for yourself, something you enjoy doing. Other people might be impressed somewhat by it, but you can't really do much with it besides show off - really like any other type of object flourishing. So if you're having fun with that, cool. But, yes, magic hits people harder because people are actually interested in that, assuming you're a decent performer.

As to what you should get - whichever you're more excited about, really. We can't make that choice for you. Which do you want to learn more about right now?

Which one is better, the True Astonnishment DVD's or the Art of Astonishment books?

The books. The Art of Astonishment set is one of the best investments you can make in magic. Lots of great card stuff in there - Reset, Invisible Palm, the Anything Deck - even an impromptu Invisible Deck routine, using just a regular deck. Harris is a creative genius, and you'll find at least a million tricks you love. His inventive mind is all over the place.

I'm going to recommend those over the DVD set for you because a) they're infinitely cheaper, and b) a lot, lot, lot more material there. True Astonishments has some great stuff in it, but I feel the books might be a better investment for you.

Although, if you haven't gotten already, Card College is, in fact, an excellent source for card magic and sleights.

 

[Squ!rrel]

Thanks, I read the reviews but there are still some questions that come to mind.

Maybe tell us what those questions are then? It's impossible to help if you throw out vague questions like 'Which is better?' You also completely changed the topic of the thread, first you want to buy another effect or Jerry's encyclopedia and now it's TA vs AOA? I think you should have a serious think about where you want to go with magic and flourishing and what type of magic you want to do. It seems like you don't really have much idea right now, I get the impression you hear about something and decide you want it without knowing much about it.
We're here to help but you need to do some of the work yourself.

 

[MagicLemonBird]

Basically, I would call myself in magic a early intermediate and I am not sure if the Art of Astonishment would be too hard for me since Paul Harris is a legend.

 

[Squ!rrel]

Basically, I would call myself in magic a early intermediate and I am not sure if the Art of Astonishment would be too hard for me since Paul Harris is a legend.

The Art of Astonishment is not particularly difficult in technique, there are a few more advanced items but most of it isn't especially difficult. You should be able to do sleights such as card controls, forces, false counts etc. Basically you need to be able to do all the basics and be generally comfortable with a deck of cards. Presentation is what's going to make these effects special to your audience though, you should try to understand what PH was thinking when constructing these effects and I suspect this might be a bit above you for now (I don't mean this as an insult, I just don't think you're at a stage where you could fully appreaciate Paul Harris' work as you're new to magic, i'm talking from experience as I bought AOA way too early and didn't really appreciate it when I first got it.)

I have found TA is easier in terms of technique as the effects have been constructed to have as few sleights as possible and obviously the video explanation helps. In terms of practical effects you can use every day, AOA has quite a few more (although this is to be expected as it contains way more effects).

I don't know how skilled you are but I get the feeling you should maybe wait a bit longer before getting AOA and TA maybe a bit too much of an investment for you at this stage.

I'd recommend working with what you already have and trying to perfect the fundamentals of sleight of hand and go out and learn about performance. Take a look at some of the classic texts (if you haven't already) such as The Royal Road to Card Magic and Expert at the Card Table (available for free, legally, here http://www.erdnase.com/search.html).

 

[Rmana]

I really don't think it should matter what we think... if you like magic, do magic, and if you like flourishing do flourishing. You can work on both and it will be fine.

 

[MagicShadow9]

Alright i highly doubt you'll be reading this but i have time on my hands so i'll just say it.

For me, flourishing is a self thing. I do it as something to do when i'm bored. I don't really use it to amaze people. Sometimes when i'm hanging out with friends, i'll start flourishing but people just say "That's pretty cool" they would never say "The f***ing impossible!!!!"

I like magic a lot more than flourishing because it allows you to connect with people and make friends. Plus, i just love the thrill of performance and the reactions on their faces. For me, that's more fulfilling then making a flourishing video to please people over the internet.

 

[MagicLemonBird]

Alright i highly doubt you'll be reading this but i have time on my hands so i'll just say it.

For me, flourishing is a self thing. I do it as something to do when i'm bored. I don't really use it to amaze people. Sometimes when i'm hanging out with friends, i'll start flourishing but people just say "That's pretty cool" they would never say "The f***ing impossible!!!!"

I like magic a lot more than flourishing because it allows you to connect with people and make friends. Plus, i just love the thrill of performance and the reactions on their faces. For me, that's more fulfilling then making a flourishing video to please people over the internet.

That is true, I think that I'll will do both and buy the AOA first and then the EPCF
Because I'm not finished with the triology yet.

But now I am beggining to start to want to do both but I hear that it is best to focus on one at a time. It's a real hard pick for I like both of them.

 

[MagicLemonBird]

Here's why I love both. Flourishing, as MagicShadow9 is for your own purpose and fun so I really love it. The down side is that people won't have great reactions like a magic trick
For magic, I really like it, but not as much as flourishing and magic gets greater results and etc.

 

[praetoritevong]

Well there's no reason you can't work on both, and spend a little more time with what you like better. Me, it's the other way around. I flourish a little, but most of the time I practice magic instead. It's normal to have a preference and to like both.

 

[MagicLemonBird]

Yeah, but I think that I should focus mainly on one at a time until I master it. I'm having a really tough time picking between whcih one to learn first. Flourishing is just SO fun. And magic impresses so many people. If I follow flourishing I'm going to get the Encyclopedia of Playing Card Flourishes. If I follow magic, I'm going to get Art of Astonishment and True Astonishment. I feel it's time that I picked a definite side to work with.

 

[MagicLemonBird]

And the weird thing is that for periods of time, I will favor one against the other and then after that peiod passes I will favor the other over the other. So my favors on cardistry and magic change.

 

[praetoritevong]

Mastering either will be a lifelong journey, though. People take decades to reach what we might call 'mastering' either art. This is certainly true of magic, perhaps shortened to years for flourishing. So don't expect to master one before continuing onto the other. imo, if you're in a flourishing mood, focus on that. If you then decide you want to focus on magic for a while, change and do that. Habits and likes change constantly.