Hi everyone! I am just getting into the whole actually getting paid to do magic thing..... and i have a possible weekly/daily gig at a bar/pub i was wondering how much i should expect to get paid an hour by the restaurant?
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charging for close up
- Thread starter bucknkick97@aol.com
- Start date
Well, I have several questions. To answer your question, the general rule of thumb is to take the most expensive thing on the menu, triple its price, round to the nearest ten, and that's your hourly rate.
That said, what's the venue like? What the crowd there? What are the slow days and busy days on average? How much experience do you have performing for live audiences? What material do you have? At this point, I have no idea who you are so I can't tell if this is a good move for you or not. Information would help.
That said, what's the venue like? What the crowd there? What are the slow days and busy days on average? How much experience do you have performing for live audiences? What material do you have? At this point, I have no idea who you are so I can't tell if this is a good move for you or not. Information would help.
well it is a smaller kind of bar slash pub that makes pizza and brews their own beer they frequently hire people to sing there and i can say i really dont know what their rush is like iv only been there like 2 or 3 times. As for me and my material i do alot of close up card work & mentalism i have about 4 years experience doing unpaid gigs and preformances so im very confident at this point. however this place is in a very small town, and i dont expect them to be able to pay me as much as say a restaurant in NYC or a bigger city.
Hi Buck, by the way you are describing this place it doesn't sound like the money will be "rolling" in so to speak. I'm guessing you might be able to charge $50.00 per hour, even that would be high by the way you are describing it, but that is just going off of you telling me that it is a pizza / beer type bar.
You are correct, they will not and won't pay your the $100-$150 an hour that some guys get strolling at the higher class restaurants, however there is a plus to your venue that you may not have thought about yet. The clients that come through that door are probably going to be your family dads who will hire you for their kids birthday parties or other outside gigs. Definitely take the gig and see how it goes.
I typically get anywhere between $75.00-$100.00 per hour for strolling / table hopping in my area. One thing you can do if they give you a real low price is possibly get them to guarantee you 2-3 hours per night on their BIG nights which I'm guessing are Friday & Saturday evenings. Get in there and network and make connections. Chances are you could run into an owner of a nicer establishment and they may be interested in your services.
Two books I would recommend for you would be David Stone's book here
http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/2504
or Jamie D. Grant's new book called the Approach.
Both of these guys are a wealth of knowledge on the subject.
You are correct, they will not and won't pay your the $100-$150 an hour that some guys get strolling at the higher class restaurants, however there is a plus to your venue that you may not have thought about yet. The clients that come through that door are probably going to be your family dads who will hire you for their kids birthday parties or other outside gigs. Definitely take the gig and see how it goes.
I typically get anywhere between $75.00-$100.00 per hour for strolling / table hopping in my area. One thing you can do if they give you a real low price is possibly get them to guarantee you 2-3 hours per night on their BIG nights which I'm guessing are Friday & Saturday evenings. Get in there and network and make connections. Chances are you could run into an owner of a nicer establishment and they may be interested in your services.
Two books I would recommend for you would be David Stone's book here
http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/2504
or Jamie D. Grant's new book called the Approach.
Both of these guys are a wealth of knowledge on the subject.
And for the love of everything holy branch out from cards. Learn some sponge balls some coin work maybe a chop cup. Card tricks get old fast. You will want a three or four sets of different effects so by the time you get back to the first effect you are far enough away that the table you are at haven't seen it yet. Also you need instant resets or close to it. Nothing screams louder than a magician who has to duck out for three or four minutes after every table to reset. Also branch out from cards and get some other things outside of cards. If they are family friendly make sure you have something that little kids can follow (like sponge).
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And find the local BM and SAM groups. Find out how much the other workers in the area are charging to make sure you are not deeply undercutting the other working magicians.
P.S. Branch out from cards.
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And find the local BM and SAM groups. Find out how much the other workers in the area are charging to make sure you are not deeply undercutting the other working magicians.
P.S. Branch out from cards.
Check their reviews on yelp. Before even thinking about approaching a restaurant. ALWAYS check their reviews on yelp or any other social media site. This will prevent you ending up on a sinking ship and barely making any money at all.
I wouldn;t trust yelp anymore. Too many people who really do not understand how to review a place on there trying way to hard. This is why I go toa place a few different times over a three week time frame. Go lunch diner weekday and weekends. It lets you get a better feel then wanna be food critics.
Wow. . . last I heard close up guys were struggling to get $25.00 an hour. . . but that was in Dayton, Ohio. . .
My point is, it really does hinge on the economics of your community and local perspective; in Manhattan you can easily see $500.00 a night + tips IF YOUR IN THE RIGHT CLUB. On average I've found that very few close-up guys that do restaurant work, especially in a pub and pizza joint, see more than $150.00 a night and that includes tips. The guy working one of the area hot spots in town here gets about $250.00 a night and that's after working the spot for over a decade. So don't look at such gigs as a real source for weekly income but more as a spring board for your other work; doing home parties and corporate events. THAT is the real goal when working in this environment. . . at least that's the goal for most.
As was said, GET AWAY FROM THE CARDS! Too many magicians are addicted to card magic and fail to learn anything else but I'm going to take this a step further. If you want to do effective Mentalism GET AWAY FROM CARDS. No matter what you do card work will be seen as a card trick, there are exceptionally few card effects that come off as being solid mentalism that the layman will view as a mental mystery; most of them don't even use a physical deck of cards but the imagination. Secondly, you can usually find alternative vehicles such as buiness cards, photos and postcards, that can be adapted to most any card effect and fresh story line that is more Mentalism oriented, this is one of the great "secrets" of the craft.
On the other hand I'd tell you to chose between doing traditional magic or mentalism in that the two do not work in a supportive manner to one another, their psychological dynamics move in opposing directions in that Mentalism invokes belief where magic suspends it and invites folks in on a fantasy -- the public knows that magic is just trickery but not so with properly presented Mentalism. So think about this and what best fits you and why.
No, that doesn't mean you can't show off some magic here and there. I still do my cups & balls and other routines from time to time but not for the public. In fact, my ties to the magic community creates suspicion in and of itself but I'm too vested in the craft to segregate things. One of the reasons I am hard on myself when it comes to the material I will and will not do.
Think about it. . .
My point is, it really does hinge on the economics of your community and local perspective; in Manhattan you can easily see $500.00 a night + tips IF YOUR IN THE RIGHT CLUB. On average I've found that very few close-up guys that do restaurant work, especially in a pub and pizza joint, see more than $150.00 a night and that includes tips. The guy working one of the area hot spots in town here gets about $250.00 a night and that's after working the spot for over a decade. So don't look at such gigs as a real source for weekly income but more as a spring board for your other work; doing home parties and corporate events. THAT is the real goal when working in this environment. . . at least that's the goal for most.
As was said, GET AWAY FROM THE CARDS! Too many magicians are addicted to card magic and fail to learn anything else but I'm going to take this a step further. If you want to do effective Mentalism GET AWAY FROM CARDS. No matter what you do card work will be seen as a card trick, there are exceptionally few card effects that come off as being solid mentalism that the layman will view as a mental mystery; most of them don't even use a physical deck of cards but the imagination. Secondly, you can usually find alternative vehicles such as buiness cards, photos and postcards, that can be adapted to most any card effect and fresh story line that is more Mentalism oriented, this is one of the great "secrets" of the craft.
On the other hand I'd tell you to chose between doing traditional magic or mentalism in that the two do not work in a supportive manner to one another, their psychological dynamics move in opposing directions in that Mentalism invokes belief where magic suspends it and invites folks in on a fantasy -- the public knows that magic is just trickery but not so with properly presented Mentalism. So think about this and what best fits you and why.
No, that doesn't mean you can't show off some magic here and there. I still do my cups & balls and other routines from time to time but not for the public. In fact, my ties to the magic community creates suspicion in and of itself but I'm too vested in the craft to segregate things. One of the reasons I am hard on myself when it comes to the material I will and will not do.
Think about it. . .
Okay from where I'm sitting this is not inspiring a lot of confidence.
First problem I see is that it's a smaller venue and you're unfamiliar with their rhythms. Restaurant work is about bringing people in. The most consistent pitch is to go in during one of their slow days and act as a draw to pull in more business. If you're not pulling in more business than it costs to pay you, then you're dead weight.
Second problem I see is that you're stuck on cards and think you're a mentalist. Sorry, no. You want to do the restaurants, cards are not going to cut it. You need to do more coin work, sponges, maybe some ropes. Effects with found objects in the restaurant like shot glasses, bottle caps, napkins, etc, wouldn't hurt either. The trouble with specializing in cards is that so do a million other people.
Also, you're not doing mentalism, you're doing mental magic. I am in fact a full-time mentalist. I'm telling you now that what I do and what you do are most definitely not the same thing.
Third problem is that you're looking at this wrong. The restaurant gig is only an end unto itself if you're the house magician at an upscale place somewhere like Manhattan, LA or Chicago. Everywhere else, the restaurant gig is a means to an end, the end being the private parties. Every table is an audition.
You have a lot of work to do if you're going to make the cut.
I would suggest you look up Michael Eaton, him and Kostya Kimlat run a contracting business for Restaurant magicians in FL, also he is going to be putting out a tracking system for Restaurant performers in the next couple months.
I'd have to say no to that sort of arrangement, far too many of these specialty booking groups take the lions share of the cash and work their talent to the bone; one such company i know of would get you dozens of gigs a week but only pay you $100.00 for each one while they pocketed another $150 or more for your time. Agents . . . real agents rarely get more than 25% and you need to hold them to that UNLESS they are getting you high dollar gigs. I had an agent in Ohio that took 50% but that left me with $2,500.00 in my pocket and all expenses paid. . . that's damn good cash and a higher return than I was getting on the same show on my own. Thing is, this guy had the network and connections and he refused to book a talent he couldn't get $5k off of.
Most of the agencies I've had the displeasure of working with are filled with crooks, so be very cautious when it comes to dealing with people of this sort.
Most of the agencies I've had the displeasure of working with are filled with crooks, so be very cautious when it comes to dealing with people of this sort.
Well said Craig. I've had countless phone calls from agencies who claim that they can book me tons of shows at $100.00 a show but I guarantee they are making at least $100-$150 per show off of me. Ummm...no thanks. The funny part is that they want you to go drive an hour or two to the show, perform, and then drive two hours back home. I explained that I would be losing money by the time I filled my gas tank for $75.00 if I went with their agency. I am not going to go drive two hours and make $0.00 - $25.00 for my time and efforts. No thanks.
Another thing to think about is Charity events. Do not do them for free unless you actually know anything about said event and actually support the cause. Because if they try to get you to do for free. Remember, the DJ is being paid, The staff is being paid, The Caterer is being paid and so is everybody else there. So why shouldn't YOU get paid for your efforts?
This is not always true. You need to find out if the others are being paid, because sometimes it is really an everyone donated goods and services for the tax right off. I will do free gigs from time to time but I bill them my normal rate and then donate it back to them for tax deduction.
Krab and Randy....you guys are both correct and I have been in both situations. Sometimes they truly are trying to get your services for FREE up front and the DJ, Dunk tank, caterer are getting paid their full price. I know it sounds rude, but sometimes you just need to ask if every sponsor is donating their services and / or goods. I will sometimes just call the DJ myself and flat out ask them. When you work enough events in your area you start to see the same faces at events and they will be honest with you most of the time if they too are working for free or getting a check.
I also tend to do a lot of bartering if I know I am donating my services for free. One time I donated my services to a Subway challenge Race event (hosted by a YMCA) and in return received a summer YMCA family membership which allowed me to go work out and my wife and kids to use their pool all summer.
I also tend to do a lot of bartering if I know I am donating my services for free. One time I donated my services to a Subway challenge Race event (hosted by a YMCA) and in return received a summer YMCA family membership which allowed me to go work out and my wife and kids to use their pool all summer.
Nothing wrong with being up front and getting as much information as you can about an event. This helps weed out the people who are actually worth your time, from the people who just want your services for free (which can often times turn into a nightmare gig.)
When it comes to charity work you've been given some sound advice but understand another point; there are companies out there that specialize in throwing fundraising events and end up pocketing as much as 90% of the proceeds because of creative accounting, using "expenses" as a prime excuse to steal cash from the institution. Not all such producers are this cruel but many are so get familiar with your state laws about how much a professional fundraiser is allowed to retain, including expenses, when it comes to such functions.
The other thing that I'm very picky on is knowing how much the CEO of such charities is pocketing as a "salary" . . . some of these schmucks make millions a year and so the donated dollars aren't going to the actual charity or issue but into their pockets. I refuse to support such groups as well as those known for social-political bias like the Salvation Army; while they do help a lot of people their are strings attached, the sort of strings that go against my own sense of ethics and I'd believe, those of many others.
Select a handful of charities you will support with your time. I tend to support local animal shelters or rescue groups, the MS. Society (for obvious reasons) and literacy programs. I likewise do a Consumer Awareness talk with Seniors as well as collage aged students when it comes to how to I.D. corrupt Psychics and would be cult situations. Ironically, some of my biggest supporters of this program are other Psychics. . . kind of says a lot about their integrity, doesn't it?
Just some food for thought
The other thing that I'm very picky on is knowing how much the CEO of such charities is pocketing as a "salary" . . . some of these schmucks make millions a year and so the donated dollars aren't going to the actual charity or issue but into their pockets. I refuse to support such groups as well as those known for social-political bias like the Salvation Army; while they do help a lot of people their are strings attached, the sort of strings that go against my own sense of ethics and I'd believe, those of many others.
Select a handful of charities you will support with your time. I tend to support local animal shelters or rescue groups, the MS. Society (for obvious reasons) and literacy programs. I likewise do a Consumer Awareness talk with Seniors as well as collage aged students when it comes to how to I.D. corrupt Psychics and would be cult situations. Ironically, some of my biggest supporters of this program are other Psychics. . . kind of says a lot about their integrity, doesn't it?
Just some food for thought