Not a problem man - incidentally, I've edited the post above with a longer post, for those who may have seen the topic during the edit.
How many people have used these products in the past week?
- Thread starter praetoritevong
- Start date
Who was that?
Just to further clarify, I try and get the most out of anything I buy, and I think from all the single tricks I have bought, I have probably got the most out of Sitgmata, because it can be played as anything. Serious, or comedy, using any patter. It has so much potential, for example, last time I performed it I used something about a sexual connection. Turned out pretty good, I'll use it again.
I'm just using Stigmata as an example, and will try and get the most out of every effect.
None. But I don't own a single Ellusionist trick, and I only own few T11 ones (most of which I bought ages ago when I was first starting magic and going through that 'need everything' phase. I haven't bought a single dvd for ages. Any that DO come out, I think very carefully about whether I'd actually use it before getting it. So no, I don't use Stigmata. But I don't actually own Stigmata either.
just to clarify, you had to purchase the effect from ellusionist or t11, right? I own and perform, not so much last week as I already stated, tricks that can be learned at theory11 but I did not buy them from there. I learned a lot of chris Kenner stuff from his book, and I own a couple dm PDFs. I use the bluff pass which I did not learn from here and other things like that. Does that count?
The Biddle Trick or Elmer Biddle's Transcendent was first published in April 1947 in Genii Magazine pg. 241
So i don't think u've been performing it before it came out lol
Umm i've been busy this week so i haven't performed that much. Sorry
There will always be that natural favoritism towards something new and fresh. I came up with a sandwich effect and have been doing nothing but that to people for the past 2 weeks. I'm sure that after a while I will lose interest in it and perform something better. But to answer the original post, I've used Thread yesterday. By the way, did you mention Twisting the Aces because Wayne Houchin used it?
This week I performed Factory Sealed about a million times, Distortion once, and I might of used the fan control from Joel Paschall's 1 on 1, but I'm not really sure since I use it so often. Oh I also performed Stigmata and Bullet once each.
I really don't see the point of this thread. The majority of people who claim to be magicians rarely perform and when they do it's generally for friends, family or other magicians.
Someone much smarter than me said the following, and I think it's the best explanation why:
-----------
I have had personal contact with most of the major book, video, and trick releases. It is my opinion that less than 10% of the tricks offered to magicians have truly been audience-tested over any substantial period of time. I
make this claim because so few of the tricks contain the tiny details that are the result of repeated, real-world performance. The majority of the magic offered for sale to magicians was created for one reason only – to be sold to other magicians. This makes perfect sense, because 90% of the
people who call themselves magicians could not stand in front of a group of strangers and make them happy through the performance of magic. These 90-percenters are fantasy magicians; they imagine that they can perform magic. But even though they are only “make-believe” magicians,
they still need repertoire. They need fantasy repertoire. And that is exactly what the marketers of magic give them. They provide tricks that the “pretend magicians” can fantasize about performing.
When I became a magic marketer in the early 1990s I made an amazing discovery.
If you wanted to create a trick that would be a major best-seller (like a Card-Toon or a D’Lite) there was a specific requirement. The trick didn’t have to be easy enough that a hobbyist could perform it; the trick had to be easy enough that a hobbyist could imagine himself performing it.
The hobbyist sees the trick and thinks to himself, “I could do this.” He buys the trick, plays with it for an evening while fantasizing about standing in front an audience, and then throws it into his magic drawer.
---------
And I'm back. I think that quote pretty well covers the way things stand today. Will this thread encourage people to stop being "fantasy magicians"? I doubt it. Are those looking down on the non performers, people not performing the "classics" or whatever happens to be the reason for this thread out there performing? Is this thread just a way of saying that I'm out there performing when you're not, so I'm better? How do we have any evidence that's this is the case? I've seen people who espouse their theories on the peformance and theory of magic on magic boards and who have no idea what it takes to perform for a group of people.
I don't often post but I think there are times when I need to say my piece.
I hope this gives everyone something to think about
Mr Zsasz
Someone much smarter than me said the following, and I think it's the best explanation why:
-----------
I have had personal contact with most of the major book, video, and trick releases. It is my opinion that less than 10% of the tricks offered to magicians have truly been audience-tested over any substantial period of time. I
make this claim because so few of the tricks contain the tiny details that are the result of repeated, real-world performance. The majority of the magic offered for sale to magicians was created for one reason only – to be sold to other magicians. This makes perfect sense, because 90% of the
people who call themselves magicians could not stand in front of a group of strangers and make them happy through the performance of magic. These 90-percenters are fantasy magicians; they imagine that they can perform magic. But even though they are only “make-believe” magicians,
they still need repertoire. They need fantasy repertoire. And that is exactly what the marketers of magic give them. They provide tricks that the “pretend magicians” can fantasize about performing.
When I became a magic marketer in the early 1990s I made an amazing discovery.
If you wanted to create a trick that would be a major best-seller (like a Card-Toon or a D’Lite) there was a specific requirement. The trick didn’t have to be easy enough that a hobbyist could perform it; the trick had to be easy enough that a hobbyist could imagine himself performing it.
The hobbyist sees the trick and thinks to himself, “I could do this.” He buys the trick, plays with it for an evening while fantasizing about standing in front an audience, and then throws it into his magic drawer.
---------
And I'm back. I think that quote pretty well covers the way things stand today. Will this thread encourage people to stop being "fantasy magicians"? I doubt it. Are those looking down on the non performers, people not performing the "classics" or whatever happens to be the reason for this thread out there performing? Is this thread just a way of saying that I'm out there performing when you're not, so I'm better? How do we have any evidence that's this is the case? I've seen people who espouse their theories on the peformance and theory of magic on magic boards and who have no idea what it takes to perform for a group of people.
I don't often post but I think there are times when I need to say my piece.
I hope this gives everyone something to think about
Mr Zsasz
I think you've missed the point of this thread. Please read my post on the second page of this thread. It has nothing to do being better than anyone, or who performs, or the theory of performance or the theory of magic or performing for a group of people or fantasy magicians or looking down on magicians or classics or even who's out performing.
In other words, it's about nothing you've mentioned in your post. Ergo, kindly read the entire post next time.
Cheers
praetoritevong wrote:
The thing is, new products come out all the time. Some of them good, some of them not so good. But it's so easy to get caught up in the newest thing that comes out (a company can rarely afford to simply ride the wave for long, it has to continue to come up with effects to market), and forget about what we already have. From memory, Steerpike makes brilliant use of the Biddle Trick - patter about William Tell, if I remember correctly? - or something along those lines. How many people have made that much out of the potential of the Biddle Trick? How many people have actually worked on these effects and made full use of them, and how many people, by contrast, have watched the DVD, copied everything exactly, and used it badly for two weeks before raving on about the next product? And for those who actually did well with the effects, what happened? Is the desire to get the latest "greatest, hard-hitting impromptu" secret stronger than working on what already works and what does well? If so, why are you into magic?
-----
I did read the entire post and think that the comments I quoted in regards to "fantasy magicians" directly relate to your comments above, dealing with magicians abandoning material for whatever is new. No one bothers to move past the fantasy stage and actually invest effort or work into creating an effective piece of magic. They just hop onto the next effect that will fulfill their fantasy.
The thing is, new products come out all the time. Some of them good, some of them not so good. But it's so easy to get caught up in the newest thing that comes out (a company can rarely afford to simply ride the wave for long, it has to continue to come up with effects to market), and forget about what we already have. From memory, Steerpike makes brilliant use of the Biddle Trick - patter about William Tell, if I remember correctly? - or something along those lines. How many people have made that much out of the potential of the Biddle Trick? How many people have actually worked on these effects and made full use of them, and how many people, by contrast, have watched the DVD, copied everything exactly, and used it badly for two weeks before raving on about the next product? And for those who actually did well with the effects, what happened? Is the desire to get the latest "greatest, hard-hitting impromptu" secret stronger than working on what already works and what does well? If so, why are you into magic?
-----
I did read the entire post and think that the comments I quoted in regards to "fantasy magicians" directly relate to your comments above, dealing with magicians abandoning material for whatever is new. No one bothers to move past the fantasy stage and actually invest effort or work into creating an effective piece of magic. They just hop onto the next effect that will fulfill their fantasy.
Alright, fair enough, I understand where the "fantasy magicians" term came from. Nonetheless, I hardly think it is fair to post with the implication of my hypocrisy, let alone criticise my posting of this thread without evidence. Surely, if you recognise faults in the magical community, it is better to at least talk about it, than say, "This won't change anything, so I'll be negative and cynical about everything"?
Better, but too much work for most people. I mean, come on! Talking to people? Who wants to go through that nightmare?
List-o-tricks
Shadows (created on the spot)
Invisible palm (david stone's)
several different popout moves
Synergy
Mirage
Hitman
cap gun roulette (basically a bank knight done with ring caps.)
Shadows (created on the spot)
Invisible palm (david stone's)
several different popout moves
Synergy
Mirage
Hitman
cap gun roulette (basically a bank knight done with ring caps.)